Yulian Kondur on Roma Aid, Documentation, and Winter Survival in Ukraine

Author(s): Scott Douglas Jacobsen

Publication (Outlet/Website): The Good Men Project

Publication Date (yyyy/mm/dd): 2025/11/11

Yulian Kondur is a Ukrainian Roma human rights advocate, project coordinator at the Roma Women Fund “Chirikli,” and president of the Odesa Roma Rights Center. His work focuses on legal aid, documentation, and social inclusion for Roma displaced or affected by Russia’s war, alongside advocacy against discrimination. Chirikli—founded in 1994—was the first Ukrainian NGO to raise Roma women’s rights nationally and internationally and partners with institutions on mediation and inclusion. Kondur participates in regional forums and policy dialogues on Roma inclusion and Ukraine’s recovery, including Council of Europe efforts and consultations on the Roma Strategy 2030, as well as UN protection discussions. 

In this interview with Scott Douglas Jacobsen, Kondur outlines winter priorities and structural reforms. He details aid that keeps Roma displaced by Russia’s war warm and housed, health outreach from TB screening to mobile visits, and art-therapy support for women and children. A documentation pilot identified over 300 undocumented people and built a collaborative model with mediators, the Ombudsman, and migration services. Kondur warns of legal invisibility and calls for fee waivers, better data, and EU-backed funding. He flags housing shortages, weak hate-crime enforcement, and the need to train mediators and involve youth.

Scott Douglas Jacobsen: Today, we are speaking with Yulian Kondur, a Ukrainian Roma human-rights advocate, project coordinator with the Roma Women’s Fund “Chirikli,” and president of the Odesa Roma Rights Center. Odesa was my first city that I visited during some travels in 2023. One of the first sites we visited was a UNESCO World Heritage site—the Transfiguration Cathedral, which was bombed on July 23, 2023. It was an interesting and sombre sight. What are the operational priorities for Roma communities through the winter?

Yulian Kondur: This is another winter, and it is traditionally the hardest period of the year. Given the project timelines, there is also a great deal of administrative work for us. Speaking about community needs, this is one thing; the priorities of NGOs are another. Regarding our capacity, we are now focusing heavily on fundraising and maintaining the work we do. There is a cycle of applications, and we are actively engaged in it.

We have already received both positive and negative feedback on some of them, and we are planning for the second half of the winter. Much will depend on how well we can meet the needs. The priorities for winter have evolved since the beginning of the invasion. Initially, the most urgent needs were evacuations and food. Later, as the situation changed, the needs shifted as well. Nowadays, we are focusing more on keeping people warm and housed. We continue to provide essential goods—food, hygiene items—but also, specifically for winter, blankets, heaters, firewood, and warm clothing.

Currently, we prioritize displaced people—those who had to flee their homes within Ukraine. Still, we also assist local communities living in compact settlements. These are among the poorest groups in our community, and we include them as beneficiaries of this support. We no longer have cash assistance. During the first three to four months after the invasion, we did, but that was part of an emergency response. Later, we realized we did not have enough capacity to manage every case individually and verify each request. The requests varied significantly, making it challenging to apply a unified approach.

Each case demanded considerable attention, and there remained a strong demand for various types of additional support. Our network of Roma mediators, which Chirikli has coordinated nationally since the early 2010s, has been essential; dozens of mediators operate across Ukraine to bridge access to services. Most requests from community members come either through local NGOs or Roma mediators. Suppose we receive requests on Facebook or Instagram. In that case, we connect those individuals with local partners and channel support through them as the most secure and reliable way to maintain our work and connections.

Health and medical support are also key priorities. We have a long-term project in this area, in cooperation with the mediator network and institutional partners.

Our health-related work includes tuberculosis screening and treatment, case verification, and supporting patients in maintaining their health. This continues primarily in two regions—Zakarpattia (Transcarpathia) and Odesa—and to a smaller extent in the Kyiv region. At the moment, most attention is on Odesa and Zakarpattia, where there are larger numbers of Roma and many internally displaced persons.

In terms of health outreach, our work involves mobile medical visits conducted by doctors and referrals for further treatment. Roma mediators ensure that these services are accessible to Roma communities.

Mental health care is another key focus of our activities. We organize art therapy for women and children, often in shelters we support, especially one that we run entirely on our own capacity in Mukachevo. Residents and local families gather for sessions, drawing and painting, or for dance classes and other forms of creative interaction. It is a simple but effective approach—art requires little more than light, paint, and connection. It fosters interaction among people and is especially beneficial for children. We have received positive feedback from parents about these sessions.

Specifically, during winter, we continue to focus mainly on humanitarian needs, as we have for the past several years. These occupy a significant portion of our work. At the same time, we also address other issues, such as access to personal documents, responses to discrimination cases, and improvements to services for Roma communities. There are some ongoing initiatives in these areas, but for now, our priority is ensuring humanitarian safety.

Jacobsen: As a sub-question to that, for context, in January, temperatures in Ukraine can drop to minus 20 degrees Celsius—a level that many people around the world, especially those in tropical climates, can hardly imagine. January is probably the harshest month. How do you prepare for that with limited resources?

Kondur: We assess what we have available through our ongoing projects. Some of them end in December, so we try to allocate the remaining funds for essential winter items—the things I mentioned earlier, such as heating materials and firewood. We also purchase small wood-burning stoves, sometimes called potbelly stoves, as well as portable heaters or generators. These allow families to stay warm and cook food safely. We remain in close contact with people to understand their exact needs and provide assistance accordingly.

In estimating what we need to buy and how to meet people’s expectations, our Roma mediators play a central role. They inform us about what is required and how many families they can reach with the available resources. That is the most important thing for us—to understand the number of people and organize the distribution in time.

Given the current electricity shortages and the recent increase in air attacks, logistics are affected. Unfortunately, based on our experience from last winter, these conditions make it more complicated to deliver supplies quickly. Still, we are trying to complete all purchases by the end of the year and send them to different parts of Ukraine immediately. Over time, we have learned to make this process more efficient by using the most reliable delivery services. The main challenge, as always, is the cost.

We have limited resources, but we constantly fundraise and cooperate with long-term partners who remain committed to supporting Ukraine’s Roma communities. Among these are Finnish Roma and non-Roma NGOs, as well as the Government of Finland, which plays a vital role in sustaining our work. That is how we manage to continue.

Jacobsen: How is Chirikli engaging in the consultations for the Roma Strategy to 2030?

Kondur: We have been deeply engaged from the very beginning of the Roma strategy process in Ukraine. The first national Roma strategy was adopted in 2013, before the Maidan Revolution, when Ukraine’s future looked much brighter. At that time, the strategy was primarily inspired by the Decade of Roma Inclusion—an initiative of more than 15 European countries, both within and outside the EU, that coordinated efforts to improve Roma integration. Ukraine followed this model as part of its EU approximation process.

Our strength as organizations, such as Chirikli, was our long-standing involvement with the Council of Europe and other international partners. Our role was to explain to Ukrainian authorities why a national Roma strategy was essential and beneficial not only under international obligations but also for Ukraine’s own development. At the same time, we worked with Roma communities to explain that this was a positive and necessary step toward greater inclusion in public and political life, including participation in elections.

For us, it has been a privilege to remain continuously involved at different levels—especially at the policy and institutional levels—over such a long period. We have contributed recommendations throughout the process, helping to shape the national approach to Roma inclusion.

Of course, the government still plays the leading role. Not every community or organization that has access to high-level consultations necessarily experiences a reciprocal relationship where their input is truly taken into account. That said, having such access is still an advantage.

The government holds many consultations, and Roma NGOs, including Chirikli, generally maintain good relations with the authorities. However, in the end, policies are often finalized based on government priorities rather than community input. This current cycle is a clear example of that. It may be due to limited time or a shortage of human resources within the relevant ministries. The consultation process was not as inclusive or transparent as it should have been. Instead of drafting policy after community consultations, authorities prepared documents beforehand. Then they presented them for discussion—creating a “back-and-forth” dynamic rather than genuine participation.

A few months ago, the government published a two-year action plan under the broader Roma Strategy to 2030. The idea is that the strategy serves as a framework, and every two to three years, a new action plan will update priorities. When we saw the first draft, we immediately submitted a letter of concern, stating that the process did not follow standards for consulting with minorities. The positive outcome was that the government agreed to hold real consultations, with support from international partners such as the Council of Europe. These consultations were open, and participants were not afraid to voice criticism where needed. We all support Ukraine, but as civil society, we also recognize that institutions must do their part correctly.

We actively participated in shaping the new action plan, and some of its activities are already being implemented. For instance, we are mapping data on Roma populations and their needs across Ukraine. We began in the Zakarpattia (Transcarpathia) region and plan to expand to others. How far we can go depends largely on our local partners, which remains one of the biggest challenges. Many people have left Ukraine, and some NGOs have closed due to a lack of capacity.

That is why one of our priorities now is to bring new people into the movement and train new Roma mediators. Unfortunately, there is a growing trend—fewer young Roma are interested in activism. We understand the need to be creative in attracting youth to civic engagement and policy work. This must also be reflected in the strategy: how to involve young Roma in decisions that shape their future and their communities.

Regarding the strategy itself, it is closely tied to Ukraine’s European integration process. The pressure to align national policies with EU standards has, in part, caused the government to move quickly—sometimes too quickly—when drafting new frameworks. While this haste has drawbacks, it also creates an opportunity to leverage the current momentum to strengthen Roma inclusion and institutional collaboration.

It is good that this process exists, and to some extent, we benefit from it. On the other hand, we do not want European integration to be the only reason the government works on Roma issues. To balance this, a strong civil society is essential. We continue investing in it, though it remains challenging. Many human rights NGOs, including ours, are overwhelmed by service and humanitarian work, and there is also a lack of motivation among youth to engage in activism. These challenges are interconnected.

Jacobsen: What is the plan to reduce documentation gaps among displaced Roma families?

Kondur: Over the past year and a half, we have been implementing a pilot initiative to improve access to identity documents, primarily in Zakarpattia (Transcarpathia) in western Ukraine. Ukraine has a long history of working on this issue in cooperation with UNHCR (the UN Refugee Agency), the OSCE Office for Democratic Institutions and Human Rights (ODIHR), and the Council of Europe. For more than a decade, these institutions have invested considerable resources in training Ukrainian state officials and improving the administrative system, raising awareness of why it is essential to identify how many Roma remain undocumented.

This is not only a Ukrainian challenge but a regional one. Despite international attention and support, Ukraine still does not have clear statistics on undocumented Roma. Before 2022, the estimate was that around 10 percent of Roma in Ukraine lacked identity documents—roughly 30,000 people. However, even the total Roma population remains uncertain, ranging between 250,000 and 400,000. This ambiguity makes it difficult to design effective initiatives or measure policy outcomes.

When developing programs or contributing to policy, it becomes hard to determine indicators of progress or even a baseline. That is why, as part of this pilot project in Mukachevo, we sought to establish a practical model for collaboration that links civil society, local authorities, community leaders, members of Roma communities, and national institutions such as the Ombudsman’s Office and the Commissioner for Equality. Everyone worked together toward the same goal: ensuring that Roma people have access to documentation and, by extension, to their rights.

The first step in this initiative was taken by Roma activists—our Roma mediators, in particular. They visited communities to identify undocumented individuals and encourage them to come forward. This was not easy. Many Roma lack trust in state institutions, which makes them reluctant to disclose their undocumented status. Especially now, amid mobilization, some men have hesitated to obtain official documents out of concern that it could increase scrutiny or obligations. Given the broader context, this hesitation is understandable.

During the pilot, Roma mediators identified over 300 undocumented individuals and categorized them according to their specific situations. Some had lost their documents; others had never had any. Some possessed only birth certificates, while others still held Soviet-era (USSR) passports and had never transitioned to Ukrainian documentation.

There were several stages of cooperation. First, mediators gathered data. Then, the Ombudsman’s Office verified it. Afterward, the State Migration Service cross-checked records in national registries. Finally, lawyers and mediators accompanied community members to their appointments at migration offices, where staff were already briefed and ready to process their cases efficiently.

It was a resource-intensive process, but it demonstrated that progress is possible when there is commitment and coordination. The biggest challenge was maintaining contact with individuals—many had moved to other regions or even abroad. From the 300 cases, around 30 people were eventually lost to follow-up.

Nevertheless, the initiative produced valuable recommendations, which were presented during the summer. These recommendations were submitted to the State Service of Ukraine for Ethnic Policy and Freedom of Conscience, the authority responsible for Roma issues. Elements of this pilot are now reflected in the current Roma Strategy Action Plan, and follow-up activities will be based on this work.

However, continued implementation depends on resources. Much of the funding currently relies on local budgets, which are under pressure due to decentralization reforms and wartime priorities. Local authorities understandably focus spending on defence and emergency needs, making it difficult to allocate funds to minority inclusion. We are advocating for dedicated funding—perhaps through EU programs or international donors—to ensure that national minorities, including Roma, have consistent support.

This work is also coordinated with other minority organizations to ensure that all vulnerable communities receive attention, particularly regarding their socioeconomic situation. To summarize, our pilot initiative on documentation builds upon a long history of cooperation with international human rights bodies. Ukraine has received many recommendations and guidelines over the years to improve Roma access to personal documents, and we base our work on these international standards. It is a long process, and as we have seen in other countries, achieving full documentation coverage can take many years—but persistence is key.

The goal was not only to document and educate but also to propose improvements to the administrative system—how it could better handle people in such vulnerable situations. One of our key recommendations, also reflected in international human rights reports, is to waive administrative fees for those who are both economically and socially marginalized. Many undocumented Roma fall into this category.

Of course, this should not apply to all Roma, because not all Roma are poor. It is important to avoid generalizations that erase the community’s diversity. Sometimes, when we focus on the whole group, we lose sight of those nuances.

Jacobsen: Following from that, what about the risks of statelessness? You mentioned that some Roma avoid registration due to mobilization concerns, while others are displaced. When I was in Kharkiv in 2024, I interviewed several elderly Roma whose homes had been destroyed in bombings. They had lost everything—their homes, documents, and independence—and were now living as dependents in new locations. It was not just a material loss but a deep psychological one. Given this context, what are the main risks of statelessness, and are there particular nuances within that?

Kondur: The concept of statelessness is complex when it comes to Roma. Many Roma who are undocumented still consider themselves citizens of Ukraine; they do not question their belonging. The problem arises because the state questions it. This reflects both a conceptual issue and a legislative gap.

Ukraine does not have an official status for undocumented citizens. In 2019 or 2020, a Law on Stateless Persons was adopted, but it remains little known and rarely used. Few lawyers specialize in it, and there have been very few cases of people successfully receiving stateless status. In some instances, lawyers help undocumented Roma obtain citizenship through this law. Still, paradoxically, the process can render them legally stateless, even though they were born and have lived their entire lives in Ukraine.

Essentially, undocumented Roma become legally invisible—a phrase we often use. They exist socially but not legally. Without documentation, they cannot fully prove their citizenship or access fundamental rights. Over time, this invisibility creates the real risk of statelessness, not because of displacement or renunciation, but because of administrative exclusion.

Among Roma activists and human rights advocates across Europe, we often say that Roma are at risk of statelessness. The term “at risk” is key—we cannot always determine whether individuals are legally stateless, because it depends on local legislation and administrative practices. The danger lies in the gap between self-perception and legal recognition.

Jacobsen: From what you are saying, the psychological and social reality seems clear. Many Roma feel fully integrated as Ukrainians—they are born and raised there and have no doubts about their belonging. The issue, then, is legal recognition and wartime hesitancy to register, especially for men of military age who might face conscription. Is that a fair reading?

Kondur: I would not say that avoiding the draft is the main reason Roma men do not obtain personal documents. It can be a secondary hesitation, but the primary obstacle is low legal awareness—a lack of understanding of rights and obligations. Added to that is deep mistrust toward institutions, often stemming from negative encounters with law enforcement. This mistrust can be generational.

In many Roma families, parents lack complete documentation, and their children grow up the same way—perhaps with partial papers, such as birth certificates, but no passports. Over time, this creates a cycle where interacting with authorities becomes culturally unfamiliar, even intimidating. From a human rights perspective, the state has the responsibility to identify these gaps and build trustworthy, accessible systems that people can rely on.

Jacobsen: Would you say this mistrust is bi-directional? It sounds as though Roma distrust institutions, but institutions also distrust Roma.

Kondur: Yes, it works both ways. That is one reason our initiatives have succeeded—we try to bridge that divide. What has often been missing is something to connect both sides. For example, after a series of anti-Roma attacks in 2018–2019, we began organizing dialogue sessions and trainings between local Roma communities and police.

We called one initiative “Coffee with a Policeman.” It started in Kyiv, bringing people together in an informal setting—no podiums, no uniforms, no pressure. The goal was simple: conversation. Police ensured safety, and Roma participants shared their perspectives directly. Not all meetings were smooth. Some ended tensely because fear and mistrust run deep. But showing up face-to-face made a difference. It was a small but real step toward mutual understanding.

Jacobsen: And when Roma did not show up to the event, police officers would say, “You see, we were right in our thinking about them—they have something to hide.” I am trying to have a balanced perspective on it. It is not always positive.

Kondur: There is much tension, and in some communities, there are different cases of excessive use of force by police or of police profiling—ethnic profiling. Sometimes these go unanswered, without any prosecution for wrongdoing. It is challenging to build Roma–police relations in such contexts as well. Before engaging in such conditions, as Roma activists, we need to learn to research the area we are engaging in.

Jacobsen: Where are you seeing the sharpest barriers to services for Roma IDPs—internally displaced persons—or returnees?

Kondur: I recommend housing. Housing is a significant issue. We can also discuss different categories of people here. There are Roma whose houses are in the temporarily occupied territories. There is a category of people who did not have documentation for their homes, which also ties into the issue of identity documents.

It is again closely connected to what we were discussing. But what I want to emphasize here is that it is difficult for Ukraine—for the Ukrainian government—to verify that you had housing there when you do not have the complete package of documents confirming it—our previous monitoring visits to the Donetsk and Luhansk regions before the war confirmed this. There are problems with unregistered housing in Roma settlements. We did not work on it in depth, but we know the issue, we have spoken up about it, and we have tried to prepare the government for this.

This needs to happen at some point, and we need to have a plan. At the moment, the current policy documents do not reflect it. However, I know some international Roma organizations are discussing how to help Ukraine respond to this, because it involves both internally displaced persons (IDPs) and returnees from abroad.

Another issue is social housing in Ukraine. It might sound too strong, but in fact, it is almost non-existent. There are long waiting lists for social housing—people wait for years, and only a few get it. Now, the priority will naturally go to those from the front lines and veterans, which makes it difficult for Roma or other vulnerable groups to benefit. It is hard to imagine how to ensure access to social housing for Roma under current conditions.

The only positive example I know of was in Uzhgorod, where local authorities agreed to set up a social housing project for Roma—but only on the condition that foreign funding would support it. They were not ready to allocate money from the local budget, so it never happened. That was a few years ago, before the full-scale invasion.

For internally displaced people, employment and education are also significant issues. We have some programs for Roma women and men—mostly women—focused on vocational education to help them gain professional qualifications and find work. There has been some success, but many Roma do not qualify for these programs because they lack the required level of formal schooling. According to the legislation, you must complete at least nine grades, but some do not.

With NGOs, we create more flexible programs. For example, we offer short-term vocational courses—like food preparation or confectionery skills, not necessarily “chef training,” which sounds too formal—more like home economics.

This kind of training is more practical and grounded in people’s real needs. Housing, employment, and education are deeply connected. When we provide education that can directly improve people’s economic situations, there is greater demand than, say, for human rights workshops. Of course, there is also a psychological aspect—people need more interaction and integration with the new communities where they live as displaced persons.

One excellent study from the International Renaissance Foundation examined the circles of interaction among Roma communities. They were estimating the economic potential of the community and also looked at who the Roma spend most of their time with. The research showed that Roma tend to interact primarily within their own community, limiting opportunities for broader integration.

When people are displaced, they are forced to move beyond their familiar social circles, and that can be challenging—not everyone is ready for it. We can make our events and meetings more inclusive. I am now focusing on organizing cultural events to help people blend, to show that diversity is natural—that their environment can be diverse and safe.

Many issues internally displaced persons face. I myself was displaced for the first month when Russian forces surrounded Kyiv. I was not sure if I would ever return home. During that time, I began working on humanitarian aid in Chernivtsi, in southwestern Ukraine. I also felt much pressure—to do more, to help others—and it was very challenging psychologically.

Jacobsen: What legal or policy reforms would effectively curb hate speech against Roma?

Kondur: Ukrainian legislation has a very high threshold for an act to qualify as hate speech. It must be proven with strong evidence, often including the attacker’s own testimony acknowledging hateful intent toward a group. There have been some improvements—especially since the invasion, more cases are registered as hate crimes or hate speech—but most do not reach the courts with those legal qualifications. Prosecution and courts frequently reclassify or drop the hate element.

In general, the legal qualification of hate crimes is still inconsistent in our system. What could improve things is to regulate hate speech more clearly and effectively. At Chirikli, we have been consistent on this point, together with other NGOs, pushing for legislative reform and a stronger judicial understanding of hate-motivated crimes.

The push for reform is not only from Roma civil society but also from human rights organizations, LGBT groups, and disability advocates. It is very intersectional. We all agree that incitement to hatred should not appear only in the Criminal Code but also in the Administrative Code, where the threshold of proof is lower.

For example, there were cases when radical groups burned down temporary Roma settlements, forcing families to flee. The attackers would even post videos online, openly inciting hatred toward Roma. Yet the police often classified these acts as “hooliganism,” completely ignoring the hate motivation. Sometimes, under international and civil society pressure, the classification is changed—but we still have no successful convictions. That means, in practice, there is still impunity for such acts.

There is a bill in Parliament intended to address this issue. It used to be numbered 1488, but the new version has a different number now. The proposal incorporates many of the discussions we have had with parliamentarians and legal experts. Its main goal is to lower the evidentiary threshold and to expand the list of protected characteristics, not leaving it open-ended but specifying them clearly.

[ED. Ukraine’s hate-crime reform effort centred on Government Draft Law No. 5488 (registered 13 May 2021), which sought to amend the Criminal Code and the Code of Administrative Offences to recognise hate crimes on broader grounds—including sexual orientation and gender identity—and to treat “intolerance” as an aggravating circumstance. The draft did not pass and was withdrawn in July 2025. It has been superseded by Draft Law No. 13597 (registered 4 August 2025), which proposes expanding protected characteristics, introducing administrative liability for non-violent discriminatory acts, and creating a distinct criminal offence for public calls to violence motivated by intolerance.]

At present, sexual orientation is still missing from the list, which the LGBT community is fighting to include. This is important because hate-based attacks often go unrecognized as such by law enforcement. Strengthening cooperation among communities—Roma, LGBT, disability rights activists—helps us build a united front.

Looking at past cases, the focus should not only be on proper legal qualification but also on ensuring that victims receive the necessary support. When the government fails to recognize a hate crime early in the investigation, victims lose access to resources they need. Being the target of a hate crime can be especially traumatic, so institutional recognition matters deeply.

Jacobsen: Thank you very much for your time today—it was a pleasure speaking with you.

Kondur: Yes, let us stay in touch. 

Jacobsen: You are very welcome. It is an ongoing process, as always.

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