This Gay Week 7: Resurgent Anti-LGBTQ Hate, Snoop Dogg’s Growth, and Global Queer Rights

Author(s): Scott Douglas Jacobsen

Publication (Outlet/Website): The Good Men Project

Publication Date (yyyy/mm/dd): 2025/10/24

Karel Bouley is a trailblazing LGBTQ broadcaster, entertainer, and activist. As half of the first openly gay duo in U.S. drive-time radio, he made history while shaping California law on LGBTQ wrongful death cases. Karel rose to prominence as the #1 talk show host on KFI AM 640 in Los Angeles and KGO AM 810 in San Francisco, later expanding to Free Speech TV and the Karel Cast podcast. His work spans journalism (HuffPost, The Advocate, Billboard), television (CNN, MSNBC), and the music industry. A voting member of NARAS, GALECA, and SAG-AFTRA, Karel now lives and creates in Las Vegas.

Bouley, a pioneering gay broadcaster and activist, joins Scott Douglas Jacobsen for This Gay Week to discuss America’s rising hostility toward LGBTQ communities. Bouley argues that hatred in the U.S. operates like a “volume knob,” amplifying under anti-gay administrations and softening under supportive ones. He connects this resurgence to declining education, social-media toxicity, and emboldened bigotry. Bouley commends figures like Snoop Dogg for genuine growth and condemns the defunding of queer health agencies under Trump. He also warns that Turkey’s proposed anti-LGBTQ laws mirror far-right American ambitions, framing global queer rights as a battle between progress and regression.

Scott Douglas Jacobsen: Today, we are here with Karel Bouley for This Gay Week. We are going to go through some news. 

Karel Bouley: What a week it was! What a week everything is.

Jacobsen: I want to start this session with something I have been thinking about. You would have a more informed opinion than I would, being an American and knowing the community. Cultures change—sometimes they evolve, sometimes they devolve—but they’re dynamic regardless. How is hate expressed socially in the United States against LGBTQ people in the 2020s?

Bouley: Openly. That’s really it. “Everything old is new again.” There’s nothing new. People like to think there is, but it’s all happened before. As Barbra Streisand once said, there are eight bars and sixteen notes—it’s all been done before. LGBTQ hatred in society, in all societies, is cyclical.

It cycles between being overt, public, and in your face, to quieter periods when people keep it to themselves. South Parkactually nailed this dynamic—Season 27 opens with “Sermon on the ’Mount.” Later, there’s an episode titled “Woke Is Dead,” which plays with the idea that “woke is dead” and bigotry is suddenly loud again.

Cartman says, “Where do I fit in? I’m not unique anymore.” That captures what we’re talking about. Society goes through periods of LGBTQ acceptance, where the noise and hatred die down. Things become quieter, more private, less overt.

Then we move into periods of overt hatred, when people don’t care—they say and do terrible things publicly. Government mirrors society, and society mirrors government. When the government is anti-gay, people feel emboldened to be anti-gay. When the government is pro-gay, anti-gay rhetoric quiets down and supportive voices grow louder.

That’s why the “bully pulpit” matters—it’s probably the president’s biggest lever: setting the country’s tone. When you have presidents like Obama or Biden—or even Clinton, though two of the worst anti-gay policies of the era, Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell and DOMA, happened on his watch—the overall tone toward LGBTQ people softens. Does hatred go away? No. It goes back into the closet.

When you have presidents like Bush, Reagan, or Trump, LGBTQ hatred gets louder. It is not evolution or devolution; it is a volume knob. What decibel level is the hatred this week? It is always there. It has never disappeared.

America also has an education problem. IQ tests are normed to an average of 100 by design; popular summaries sometimes peg the U.S. around the high-90s, but those estimates are debated. What isn’t discussed: literacy and learning setbacks are real. In 2022, about 30–32% of eighth-graders performed below NAEP Basic in reading, and in 2024, about 40% of fourth-graders were below Basic. The average ACT composite lately has hovered around 19–19.5 out of 36. We are under-educating many kids, and that is not accidental. Education has been starved of sustained investment.

Screens do not help when overused. Evidence links heavy social-media use with slightly lower reading and memory scores in early adolescence, and several reviews connect excess screen time with attention problems. It is easier to inflame people—especially with sound bites and no critical thinking—when attention and reading stamina are thin.

Right now, the volume level of LGBTQ hatred—particularly toward trans people—feels like a seven out of ten. Under Biden, it felt more like a four. The amount of hate does not necessarily change; the loudness does. And in sixty-three years on this planet, I have never seen it vanish.

There has never been a time when gay people have felt entirely accepted, loved, and part of society. Case in point—one of the stories I sent you today: LGBTQ youth mental health and crises are at an all-time high. That comes directly from Trump and the MAGA movement.

Both the legislation against LGBTQ people and the rhetoric surrounding it, especially in local communities, have created a climate of hostility. The noise level of the hatred is deafening. Young kids today aren’t used to that volume. They grew up under Biden; they came of age when the level of hate—the “volume”—was at about a four. Now it’s been cranked up. They’ve never experienced it like this before, and their mental health is being directly affected by what’s happening. It’s not that hate was gone—it was just quieter.

Jacobsen: I’ve seen reports from the United States, especially from New York, of men randomly punching women in public. These are essentially random acts of misogynistic violence. Some of these incidents have caused serious facial injuries. Does this kind of violence extend to the LGBTQ community as well?

Bouley: Of course. Hate crimes against LGBTQ people are rising—particularly against trans people. Absolutely. I personally know people who were walking down the street and got attacked, even in West Hollywood.

Look at what happened in Australia—young men were luring gay people using dating apps just to assault them. They’d arrange a meeting through a gay dating app, and when the victim arrived, they’d be ambushed and beaten by a group of attackers. That happened. The L.A. Times just ran a front-page story about a man arrested for killing four people he met through Grindr. He would lure them either to his home or theirs, then kill them.

That’s why using a dating app can feel like putting a target on your back. Violence has become so unpredictable. You’re talking about crimes happening barely a mile from my house. I’m seriously considering not using dating apps anymore for that very reason—because we’ve become targets.

And yes, it’s happening to women. I think it’s always happened to women, but it’s being publicized more now. Ask any woman—she’ll tell you that going out as a woman can be dangerous. The same goes for LGBTQ people. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been leaving a gay bar, and people walking by on the street started punching or harassing patrons. I’ve seen it firsthand for decades.

It’s happening to gay and trans people—especially trans people right now. And I don’t see it slowing down. That’s why, for a long time, there were groups called the Pink Panthers—armed neighbourhood watch groups of gay people who patrolled their communities to protect one another from harassment and violence.

I believe they were called the Pink Panthers. And yes, absolutely, it’s still relevant. I’m not saying violence against gay people has gone on longer than violence against women. Still, there’s definitely more public outrage when it happens to women than when it happens to gays. That ties directly into what we discussed earlier about levels of hatred.

For many people, a gay person getting beaten up for being gay is seen as “par for the course.” Historically, you can trace that normalization back to when such violence and condemnation were codified—and even sanctified—in religious texts.

Jacobsen: There’s that biblical line — “a man shall not lie with another man, for it is an abomination.”

Bouley: Yes, but first of all, that’s from the Old Testament, and the phrasing people know today comes from the King James Bible — rewritten by King James I of England. That line is not what the original Hebrew text said. The sentiment of the Old Testament was very different, and it was never about homosexuality. Homosexuality is never mentioned in the Bible at all, and it certainly isn’t in the Ten Commandments. If it were so important, you’d think it would have been included there.

Jacobsen: That’s a broad generalization, but also the interpretation varies widely across denominations, right?

Bouley: Yes, but those interpretations are extraordinarily wrong. The same churches that use that passage to condemn homosexuality ignore the rest of Leviticus, like the verses saying that if your wife doesn’t walk three steps behind you, you can stone her, or if she wears purple, she can be killed. They pick and choose the parts that justify their hatred. They want to hate gay people, so they find a biblical reference that doesn’t mean what they claim it means, and they cling to it. But they don’t cling to the parts about eating pork or other ancient prohibitions.

There was even a debate where someone confronted Charlie Kirk about this. The person said, “You say gay people should be stoned because of the Old Testament.” And Kirk said yes, that’s what God said. Then the person asked, “Well, you have a wife — do you make her obey all the Old Testament rules too?” And suddenly Kirk said, “Well, no, that’s taking it too literally.” That’s the hypocrisy. They search for reasons to hate and tailor their book of fiction — which is what the Bible is — to match that hatred.

Jacobsen: Shifting to something current — you mentioned Spirit Day and Snoop Dogg. He recently released a song for an animated children’s show in partnership with GLAAD, featuring a love anthem for queer families. What happened in the last three years that led to this shift?

Bouley: Snoop — who I love and admire — used to live about eight blocks from me. I even saw him perform once at VIP Records in Long Beach, a landmark for West Coast rappers. A few years ago, he took his kids to see Lightyear, the Pixar movie, which includes a brief same-sex kiss between two women. Afterward, he commented, “There should have been a warning — I don’t want to have to explain that to my kid.”

He got much backlash for that, especially since people pointed out the irony: a man known for misogynistic, womanizing lyrics was uncomfortable with two women expressing love. That hypocrisy didn’t go unnoticed.

To Snoop’s credit, he listened. He sat down with the Human Rights Campaign and GLAAD, along with people who educated him about why his comment was hurtful. He didn’t just issue a half-hearted apology — he learned. When he later released a children’s song, he decided to include LGBTQ-positive lyrics and themes.

That’s what growth looks like. He recognized that his earlier statement was ignorant and made a conscious effort to do better. For an African American rapper of his generation — remember, Snoop’s not 20 anymore — that’s real evolution.

He comes from a different era, but I think he’s totally on the right path. As a gay person, I commend him. He said something less than inclusive, realized it was ignorant, and made it right.

Jacobsen: The Bay Area Reporter, in a piece by Matthew S. Bajko, published a study showing the LGBTQ youth mental health crisis has worsened. 

Bouley: The numbers are alarming—not a slight uptick, but a double-digit increase. It’s become fashionable again to bash, fire, or bully gay people—especially online—and there are no repercussions. It used to be, under previous administrations, that open homophobia was socially unacceptable. I’m not talking about thirty years ago. Since around 2005, for nearly two decades, it’s been largely unfashionable to be a homophobe. Now, it’s back in style, and these kids aren’t handling it well. Many are thinking about suicide.

LGBTQ youth have long had the highest suicide rates among young people, and this new data from the Bay Area Reporter and other outlets only confirms that we have a full-blown gay youth crisis. That cannot be stressed enough.

Jacobsen: So, where can these kids turn now?

Bouley: That’s just it—they can’t. They can’t turn to teachers or school administrators because Trump and his allies have effectively imposed gag orders. They can’t turn to books because schools and libraries are banning them. They can’t turn to social media because the anti-gay noise there is deafening.

The article mentioned that there are “more resources now,” even as depression and suicide rates rise. I find that questionable. Resources are being cut. In fact, during the current government shutdown, Trump has been using it to gut health organizations that serve LGBTQ people. Agencies that focus on queer health and mental health are being defunded or shut down entirely.

It’s not getting better for these kids. I think of Dan Savage’s It Gets Better campaign, which is supported by the Trevor Project, the leading organization helping LGBTQ youth. But the truth right now is: it’s not getting better. It’s getting worse. Gay organizations need to hyper-focus on the youth because they have nowhere left to turn.

Jacobsen: The Advocate also ran a related story by Christopher Wiggins titled “Trump’s Shutdown Layoffs Eliminate Entire Federal Health Agencies That Served LGBTQ+ People, Teens, and Women.”

Bouley: That ties directly into the other story. We’re seeing an increase in depression and suicide among LGBTQ youth, while at the same time, Trump is defunding or dismantling the very organizations designed to help them. The situation isn’t improving—it’s deteriorating, fast.

If I were the parent of a gay child in America right now, I’d take them out of America.

Jacobsen: Former HHS Deputy Assistant Secretary Adrian Shanker stated, “Without these people in place, it’s unlikely that a lot of these programs will be able to continue even after the government reopens.” 

Bouley: That’s the key point—he’s not just shutting them down temporarily during the crisis. When they’re shut down, he’s either eliminating them or cutting so much staff that they become functionally useless, leaving only two or three people to run an entire program.

It’s a huge problem. After the shutdown, I don’t believe these organizations will recover. The Office of Management and Budget has already confirmed substantial workforce reductions across multiple agencies. He’s doing it across the board. Between 1,100 and 1,200 HHS employees have already been fired. More layoffs are expected this week at the CDC, wiping out entire divisions.

These include departments overseeing epidemiology, global health, and morbidity tracking. The CDC’s flagship public health bulletin was dissolved. A senior CDC scientist said the agency is “not functioning.” Within HHS, a former senior environmental administration official told The Advocate that the Office of Population Affairs—which administers Title X family planning programs, teen pregnancy prevention initiatives, and LGBTQ health programs—has been eliminated.

So no, it’s not getting better.

Jacobsen: Shanker also said, “This new reduction in force is devastating.” In The Hollywood Reporter, James Hibberd wrote an article titled “Pentagon Criticizes Netflix for ‘Woke Garbage’ in Wake of Gay Marine Drama ‘Boots.’” This is the one you wanted to discuss.

Bouley: “Woke garbage” that they haven’t even seen! They refused to comment on the show because, according to the Pentagon spokesperson, Peter Hegetschweiler—or whatever his name is—he admitted he hadn’t watched it. So they’re condemning something sight unseen.

Boots is based on a novel called The Pink Marine, written by Greg Cope White, who was a closeted man when he served. It’s fascinating because he’s not some prominent rainbow-flag-waving activist. He’s more reserved about it.

He wasn’t trying to be a poster child for gay pride. What this show captures beautifully is what life was like for Americans—because before you’re gay, you’re an American—who wanted to serve their country before Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell.

That policy, flawed as it was, was still better than what came before. Boots shows the pain and anguish caused by a system where being gay in the military could get you criminally prosecuted or thrown in jail.

And talk about witch hunts—Trump’s favourite term. The military conducted countless witch hunts during that time, wasting immense resources trying to root out people who just wanted to serve. Boots is a remarkable depiction of life in the military before Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell, told from the perspective of a closeted man.

In real life, Greg Cope White had a chance to get out. His eccentric mother had faked his birth certificate to enroll him in school early. So when he enlisted, he thought he was 18, but he was only 17. When the truth came out, his mother showed up with papers to bring him home. The commanding officer told him that if she signed the release form, he’d have to leave—but if she didn’t, he could stay. He begged her to let him stay.

He’d found something in the military he never had before: brotherhood, camaraderie, belonging. He’d been bullied his whole life—shoved into lockers, his head shoved into toilets. But in the Marines, he found purpose and connection. For the Pentagon to dismiss this story as “woke garbage” is absurd. If I were Secretary of Defence, I’d tell everyone to watch it.

A church in Norway has just apologized for how horribly it treated gay people. All Pete Dragon’s Breath should be doing is telling people, “We’re sorry we treated Americans this way.” But instead, they are calling it “woke content.” If holding a mirror to what you did as a military is too much for you to take, that’s your problem. They don’t want to see how badly they treated soldiers who wanted to serve—soldiers who were every bit as capable and, in many cases, more so because they had to overperform. Yet they were kicked out or jailed.

It is an excellent series employing many out actors. It comes at a time when the U.S. military is shifting back toward expelling gay service members. It shows what that looks like—and it is ugly. The Pentagon should say nothing but, “We’re sorry for what we did.” Anything else is partisan politics.

Jacobsen: The Church of Norway has apologized to the LGBT community for past discrimination. Presiding Bishop Olav Fykse Tveit delivered the apology at the London Pub in Oslo, the site of a June 2022 shooting during Pride celebrations, where two people were killed. Any thoughts about this international case?

Bouley: Two things. First, spare me the apologies—let’s do better going forward. Second, it is nice that a religious organization is admitting, “We messed up. This was unacceptable behaviour. We’re sorry. People died because of it.” Religion has fueled more hatred toward LGBTQ people than almost any other institution on the planet, and that hatred has real consequences, such as those two people who died during Pride.

For the Church of Norway to step forward like this—I’d like to think others will follow. I believe the presiding bishop alluded to that, urging other religions to do the same. I doubt they will, but at least one church did. And they did it now, not last year or next, because anti-gay sentiment is rising. I think the church is trying to cool that hatred by apologizing for its past transgressions.

Movements are surging; discrimination has a new currency. Amnesty International has reacted to leaked proposals in Turkey’s draft 11th judicial package that would criminalize LGBTI people, saying such proposals “must never see the light of day.”

Only a handful of religious institutions have made amends. In 2023, the Church of England apologized for its “shameful treatment” of LGBTQ people, but still refuses to allow same-sex marriages. The Methodist Church in Ireland apologized for failing in pastoral care to gay people, yet insists marriage is only between a man and a woman. The United Church of Canada, however, went further—it apologized and reaffirmed full inclusion and radical hospitality for Two-Spirit and LGBTQIA communities. At least that church both apologized and said, “We love you, we accept you.”

They did not say, “We apologize, but we’ll keep failing you.” They said, “We failed you, and we’re going to try to stop failing you.” 

Jacobsen: The United Church of Canada has a long history of progressive leadership—it was the first to ordain women ministers in the 1930s and the first to accept an openly atheist minister, Gretta Vosper. It has been at the forefront of numerous issues in Canada, holding a special status among churches here. They apologized and, unlike others, meant it. They said, “We’re going to change our ways.” The others said, “We failed you,” but did nothing.

Turkey’s proposed 11th judicial package introduces criminal penalties targeting gay people. These proposals present a grave threat to the rights of LGBTQ people and those who advocate for them. For the first time in the Turkish Republic’s history, legislators could be considering the criminalization of any expression of gay identity, consensual same-sex activity, and access to gender-affirming care. 

Bouley Under the false guise of protecting “public morality” and “family institutions,” these measures would, in reality, tear at the fabric of Turkish society. It is a 66-page leaked draft law proposing amendments to the Turkish penal code. Some of the statutes specifically target LGBTQ people. It is the third such package within a year; the two prior ones were not formally discussed in Parliament. 

One proposed amendment to Article 225, their “indecency act,” increases the sentence for anyone publicly engaging in sexual relations or exhibitionism to up to three years in prison. Another addition states that anyone who “exhibits behaviour contrary to biological sex at birth and public morality,” or “promotes or praises such behaviour,” shall face imprisonment. This would criminalize not only being gay but also advocating for LGBTQ rights.

When I think of Turkey, I think of Midnight Express—one of the gayest films around. What happens in a Turkish prison stays there. I would never go to Turkey; as a vegan, I do not even eat turkey. There are places where it is safe to be gay and places where it is not. Turkey is one of the latter.

Where did this legislation come from? From entrenched anti-gay hatred. Turkey is one of the worst countries for LGBTQ rights, and it will not face much international pressure to stop this. There is a very real chance this will pass. If you are gay, stay away from Turkey. If you are gay and live there, get out.

If MAGA could enact everything it wanted in the United States, it would look a lot like this. Turkey’s version of Project 2025 has a shorter road to travel. In fact, they barely have a road—just a driveway to cross. Human rights, especially LGBTQ rights, have never been a priority there.

I agree with the member of parliament who said he will oppose it, but I predict that some form of the proposal will pass. Not all the penalties will be enforced, but there will be a crackdown.

Jacobsen: Thank you for your time for This Gay Week.

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